Episode 472 The Busiest Lady in WordPress With Michelle Frechette

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Show Summary

Rob Cairns talks to Michelle Frechette the busiest lady in WordPress.

Show Highlights:

1. How many hats does Michelle wear?

2. How does Michelle manage her time?

3. A general WordPress discussion

Show Notes

Hey everybody Rob turns here and today I’m here with my good and dear friend, Miss Michelle Frechette.

How are you, Michelle?

I’m doing great. Rob, how are you?

I’m doing good as we were saying before, still dealing with some of the health stuff, but you know, it’s getting there a day at a time and. Thank God for Healthcare is all I can say. There’s nothing more important than our health. So you.

Know well you’re looking good.

Thank you. Appreciate. With. That. See reached out here. I guess a couple of weeks ago and Matt Moonly called you at one time the busiest lady in WordPress and you did and I said to you more than once, I don’t know how you do it. So I thought we talked about.

He did.

How busy you are in WordPress and I I honestly think I need. I think I know a lot of. You do, but they need the scorecards, you know.

Ohh my goodness, it’s not all that.

Yeah. It’s not all that but. You’re busy and you know I and you know my late uncle used to have a philosophy. He was the CEO and he said if you want something done, you find somebody busy to figure it out because they’ll find a way to get it done right.

Yeah.

Yeah, exactly. That’s the whole the old 80209010 rule that 80% of the work it’s done by 20% of the people and some people say 90% of the work. It’s done by. 10% of the people, there’s a. Little bit of truth to that sometimes, so for sure.

Yeah, so true.

So.

I think, yeah. And I know we’ve talked a couple times on the podcast. We’ve talked a lot, one-on-one over the years. Do you ever get involved in there was solid WP’s your prime day job, right seller, sorry my my stellar WP you get involved. Stellar, like how did that all come about?

Yeah. So in 2018, January 2nd, 1st Working day of the year, I started with give WP as their head of customer success and then a few years later give was acquired by Liquid Web and they they had just created the stellar WP brand which all of the plugins and software including. Are. Theme comes under so seller WP is all of the plug insurance and all of the themes that we have at stellar WP and so when they acquired give give was acquired with that as well. Within a few months my marketing skills were recognized and I moved into the marketing team for Stellar WP and one of my colleagues, Amanda Gorman moved into my old position. Because I had a customer success.

And your marketing skills, I would say being somebody spends a lot of time marketing. Big companies are really good. I mean you know start I was talking to. You’re welcome. I was talking to a mutual friend of ours cathys and and there day and I was coming Kathy was.

Thank you.

Yeah.

I mean. Ohh my skills are really good. I said. Yeah, but you does a podcast with somebody else. Who? I think it’s just as equally good and as referring to you. So there you go. I do too. So you got that on the go and that probably occupies a big for your day right now I would think.

Yeah, I love her.

Yeah, that’s my.

Full time day job, so everything else kind of fits. In around that.

And then you’ve got. Look, man, if I’m wrong, St. podcasts on the go right now give.

Or take something like that, yeah. Anymore.

So.

So how do you manage to do 3 podcasts in a week? I have enough problems doing one with three episodes a week, so.

So they’re not on every week. That’s the thing. That’s the thing, right? And some when when the ones that aren’t paying aren’t like paying me to be, there are not the ones that necessarily get done all the way. So it’s been. Over a month or two since the WP Coffee talk has gone out, I’ve got several recorded. I just have to find the time at a better chair to sit in. That’s my biggest frustration right now is I can’t sit in this chair all day, every day. I need a better chair, but that’s coming after work camp. Yes, but. OK, so I got several episodes. Those have to go out, you know, seller WP. We have one that’s going to pick up again here in a few weeks after the summer hiatus. And then I have some live streams. The live streams are easy because it’s on the calendar. You show up, it’s live and then those are part of post status. And my Java post status, somebody else does all the production on those so. That’s easy enough, right? So we’ve got two there and then I have underrepresented in tech. With uh Simon Nassar from Yost, she and I originally ally Nimmons and I started under Representative check and then Yep, so last year Ali stepped back from that and I brought in some as my partner. And so she and I managed that together and Yost does a really nice job of doing a lot of the production for us, which is really nice. And then Kathy’s aunt and I have.

Yeah. Remember.

Motivate, which is basically our excuse to get together every week. Shoot the. Talk things through. Hopefully it inspires somebody else. We record it, we package it, we put it out every Monday or. Tuesday if I forget.

And then laugh a little bit here and there as you you do in many episodes, right?

Yeah. Ohh my gosh. Yes, so much fun, but people don’t hear. Is the half an hour beforehand that we just either commiserate or celebrate or laugh together before we hit that record button. But all of that half hour leading up to that puts us right into whatever it is that we choose to talk about that. So yeah.

So true, so true. It was funny. I was on this week and WordPress with Kathy this week. As you know. And.

Yep, Yep.

Nathan said Catherine, I just looked over the pre 20 minute chat that was going on before we live because I’m with you. I I’ve known packing a long time. I mean for years. And we commiserate every so often too. She’s.

Yeah.

Besides you one of my other favorite people in my press and you know and I I mean that like she’s and she’s been through a lot in the. Last year too.

She sure has less. Last couple of years. Yep.

Yes, I give her so much credit. I mean, a lot of people in her situation.

And.

With her family, situation would have made, it would have made it about them, and she is so not that Lady and the whole like is yeah.

Agreed. Yeah, she’s awesome.

Yeah, no question. So they do a few and and. And I know in podcasting. The recording is the easy part. It’s the.

For sure.

It’s all the even for me like. I I generally do record the tape. I’m not sure something really glaring in it and I still have 8 files that’s all together and I still have to upload and then I still have to convert it to an audio and I still have to preload it. And now I’ve changed my show notes format include speaker names so that requires more work. And then then then that.

I’ll tell you what, it’s the show notes. That’s the hardest part, like.

Ohh I know.

The video editing, I don’t edit the the the actual, you know, interviews and Katherine got it. I just had the bumpers, right. I had the intro, I had the the outro.

Yeah, yeah.

Me too.

Throw it through castles, get a transcript, fix the transcript up as much as. Possible. Kathy, for for Kathy writes the the blurb for us. I did the rest to take it up there. It takes forever to upload to video though. That’s the thing, right, like we. Upload video to YouTube some people. Like to watch you laugh some people. Just want to hear it. So we. You make it. You know, available in all those different places. And then just put it all on socialist and it doesn’t. It doesn’t seem like it should take that long, but it’s at least an hour at least, and for WP coffee talk, it’s more because I put a lot of notes in the show notes so.

I did one, I did one last week where I had my good friend Ross Brand on me with me. Ross is like a live stream universe. If you know Ross and Kevin Colby, and we talked about their new book, we get a behind the scenes on how they did the book.

Yeah.

And that those troll notes, I did them with more people on the panel. Oh my God.

Right.

Said I had to. I normally add it in one swoop and I added this one in three and it was just and I don’t know about you, but when I podcast I tend to batch so I’ll record a couple and then I’ll edit a couple and I’ll get on a roll. I’ll be sitting around on Saturday waiting to go out. It’ll be all worth my laptop. Let’s let’s headed to a couple of podcasts.

Mm-hmm.

Yes.

It’s the only way to do it. Right, so ohh.

Oh, for sure, for sure, yeah.

Now we’re. Too busy and we’ll get into some other stuff. But what’s your busy life? Do you use any tools to help you manage how busy Michelle was? Because you are busy?

I am busy, so somebody with ADHD? I try so many different things and sometimes they work and sometimes they don’t. But I live by my calendar. If it’s not on my calendar, I will not remember to show up to it. I will always be late and even if it’s on my calendar, I may be late too. So I have, you know, multiple alarms that go off on the calendar to remind me to get to things when that 2 minute. Alarm goes off like on my calendar is like, hey, you got something starting. Minutes I go immediately. I’m early cause if I think oh, I’ve got 2 minutes to do something else, it’ll be 5 or 10 minutes before I remember. I was supposed to be someplace, so I live by my calendar and Apple notes, so I use Apple notes because I’ve got them on my phone. I’ve got them on my tablet. I’ve got them on my Mac, right? So that and then. I shouldn’t even tell you all this, but I gosh, I hate to even say this. I am in my phone a lot because I live alone. That’s my connection to the outside world. For the most part.

Hello.

But I check. Slack more often than I should, and the problem is, is that I will see something that somebody will ask me to do at night when I am not in a position to do whatever it is they’re asking. But will I remember to go back and do it tomorrow? I don’t know. So I take screenshots of things and I save them in my photos and then I try to remember in the morning to look at those photos to remind me what those things that I have to accomplish during the day, so between screenshots.

No.

Apple notes and my calendar is how I usually remember to get things done.

Yeah, it’s funny because I think you and I have had a slight conversation late at night. You’ll be around it. We’ll get talking about a simple question. And that simple question morphs into five other catch up and you know.

Yeah.

Where that goes. Right.

Yeah. You said you said reply and say remind me tomorrow or I might not remember and I put the onus of responsibility back at. The other person.

You’re smart. 80 Actually it’s funny because I’m busy too, and I’m fine with me and my my other problem is not on the well, the WordPress stuff. I got a couple Fortune 500, so they do consulting with so that changes my later land a little bit. I used a note taking app. I’ve used an app called. Top one for about 5 years. Joplin is kind of an open source, like an open source OneNote, except you can put your back end database wherever. You want so you can sort on Google Drive on OneDrive. You you control where it’s. Going.

Umm I I.

Use it To Do List manager. Believe it or not, something simple like Google task because I don’t need anything complicated so I use that. I do use Google Calendar. I’d be dead without it, even though my email’s not hosted on Google.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

And then I use any smoke and then manage all my projects and stuff that I’m outsourcing and stuff. I’m moving around and all the projects out of my world. Because if you don’t have some processes in place or you’re not sure how to do it, people like you and I, and I’m ADHD as well. But I don’t know if you figured that out, but I can’t you you could say that I I can’t sit still. I get bored easily. You know? You’re just saying why you.

Yeah. Maybe, maybe.

Be doing all this? And if you don’t, the process to manage it all, it becomes a disaster, doesn’t it?

Absolutely, absolutely can for sure.

Do you do what I do just for curiosity? Do you actually go on your calendar and? They do work. Because I actually go that far. So. If I’ve got. A client I know. I gotta put two hours of work. And I’ll book the time right in my calendar. So somebody can’t overbook me. Do you actually do it?

Absolutely absolute. Absolutely. Yeah. And I have, I have used calendar for. I probably have 12 different calendars in calendar. So if somebody wants to be on my podcast on one of my podcasts, have different booking links for those you know. And if I if I am doing a photography event and I want people to be able to book their half hour with me, the different calendar for that and those all integrate with my Google Calendar.

Yeah.

So but I have to remember that like ohh. If I’m gonna be busy this weekend like one of I record on Thursday nights and Saturday mornings for coffee talk. If I have another event. Even if it’s just like, oh, I’m going away this weekend, I have to put. It on the calendar so that nobody books.

Yeah.

During that time, and I don’t have to go to the problem of saying, I’m so sorry. Can you please reschedule and those kinds of things so?

And we and we have all done that, as you know, I did that with you last week. It was like medical medical appointments come up and that’s the way it goes, you know.

It happens. Yeah, exactly. No worries, right.

Yeah. Do you color code your calendar as well, Michelle?

I do. I do so depending on what I mean. I have different calendars that come into the same calendar, so I have my personal calendars. One color I’ve got my stellar calendars and other color. Those I do that. Yeah.

Yeah, I do that too because I can look at a glance. For example, if I know in podcast records are usually they’re coded in yellow. So I can say, oh, Michelle and I are recording at 6:15. I know that I don’t even have to say, oh, that’s something else, because the way I code it, any anything in red in my calendar, stuff with my partner. That’s her in my favorite color, so that helps. That’s also the default Google Calendar color blue or not, it’s red. So anything with us personal stuff I use great, but it all depends on what I’m doing, what the colors are. So.

There you go. Yeah. Same.

So that truck works really well. Your schedule. Just for curiosity, did you throw buffer time in or transportation time? Do you factor that in or? Do you just kind of.

Yes.

I do. I do want to. I do what I need to. So for example, if I have a doctor’s appointment during the day and I have to travel to the doctor’s appointment, I will absolutely for a buffer time so that nobody looks something with me when I need to be in the car to do something else. So yeah, I will.

I’m the I’m the same way and it’s just. You know, my mom will look at my schedule and say, how do you manage this rub? Jeez, my mom’s 79 almost 80 and she’s still selling real estate. Got Buster and.

Wow.

Not the way she used to, but you know, she’s not ready to give up Googling. So. And she always says, how do you manage your time? And I said it’s hard some days, right? I mean. Management, I think for busy people like you and busy people like me are really important.

Yeah, absolutely. Otherwise you end up letting people. Down and that’s the. That’s my biggest fear is letting. People down, you know.

Ohh I know, I know it’s hard. So you got the three podcasts on the go and you’re heavily involved in post status as well, aren’t you?

I am the executive director.

And and how is that going? I mean, Corey’s a gem. The work was so I would say probably pretty well so.

Yes, he is. It’s going very well. Absolutely. Yeah. Flying out of the newsletter a little bit finding out what days work better, changing up the titles, like just things like that. Having fun. But.

What I would say to you is I like the. Newsletters on Mondays I like them on weekdays. Yeah, it’s just.

This week this week. Is coming out on Friday because, well. Because of working for us next week, so.

Yes.

And you’re not the only one writing for the newsletter. You’ve got this from Courtney Robertson, and there you’ve got a piece from Nathan Ingram in there. I believe, Nathan door.

Yeah.

Yes, that’s correct.

Do you have any other? Perhaps right now the two of them? Than you right. Pretty well sometimes.

Wiki writes Marika Vander act. Sometimes they’ll.

Yes she does.

Write an article. Yeah, but not as often. Not not weekly.

Sit today, take those articles and forward them to you and you put it all together kind of deal.

I actually have somebody that assembles the newsletter for us and then I add my pieces at the end and hit send.

Ohh, so folks, listen to that. Alright, can I? Delegation in that one woman.

Ohh you know. What? So here’s the wonderful thing about delegation. One of the things in my position in our community is people want to learn from me a lot. They say can I have some of your time? Can I do this? Can I work for you? That’s what I hear a lot. I’ll do it for free. Can I? Intern under you, but also one of the things that I preach and as far as underrepresentation and underrepresented tech, is that nobody should be working for free. And so while I have worked for free in the past because I learned that way and it worked for me, I want women. I want people of color. I want people who are just disabled. I want all those people to be compensated for their time. So when I do bring in somebody to work with me, I pay them to do that. So post status pays Lindsay Irvine to do our new. Letter I have somebody in the Philippines, Jay who messaged me and wanted to help me with something, and so he actually, you know, my Wednesday tweets that I put out all those. Jobs.

Yes.

He he sources all the jobs for me now and puts them in in the dock, but I just have to pick them up, plug them in and send out that every Wednesday and yet some Wednesdays I forget like last week. So today’s was 20 different companies hiring us, like, yeah, we’ll just put them all on the big one. There won’t be 1 next week because there can’t be us. So let’s like, really, you know, ramp it up this week.

I saw that since a little bit.

1. But I pay him and he didn’t want to be paid. But it’s it’s it’s important to me to pay people for the time that they give. And so. So I find ways to delegate when I can and when. I can afford to.

No, I’m like that. And I think one of the the misgivings we do to ourselves in the WordPress space is. We don’t charge always enough for what we’re worth, and I think that we’ve heard this complain over and over and over in the community and I and I think we should ourselves in the foot, to be honest with you, it’s our Community shooting ourselves, I mean. You know, it’s hard. I mean, you’re a community manager. That’s hard work and you know, I, as you know, I help work and manage a LinkedIn group. And that’s hard enough, believe me some days and. You know The Dirty secret with LinkedIn is it’s easier to manage the group on the smartphone than on your browser, but that’s a little tip. It really is.

I got it, I know.

Gotta tell you. But what?

And and but but with Facebook is easier on desktop than it is on the phone, at least for me. So it depends on where your groups are.

Yeah. No, I would have, you know, I have a love hate relationship with Facebook. Michelle, I have for you. Yeah. Yeah. As a marketer, I certainly do. I’ve had post band. I’ve been. I’ve had. I’ve been shot of it. I’ve had it all. And I just.

Think we all do. We all do.

Yes.

I just say no, we’re not doing it so. You know, but I think I I you should be commended for that for actually taking care of people. I think that’s really important and I think you know most people come up into a culture where they take care of people and that’s that’s the whole thing right so.

Hey. Yeah, I have received so much from so many over my career and I can’t possibly pay back everything everybody has done. So I choose to pay forward as much as I can and if I can. The way I’ve described it is you hear about these giant ice breaker boats, right, that these big ships that go ahead of the smaller boats and break up all the ice from from making a safe, safer passage and making passage possible. I think of myself as an ice breaker boat sometimes. Like if I can shove my way in and and move my arms around. A little bit. And maybe I’ve made room for a few other people to follow me into those places. And so that’s a way of paying forward by having things like underrepresented attack by, you know, speaking at conferences about under representation and raising up women and other people. Being the best ally I possibly can is a really good way to. Pay things forward.

And I came to where you do that is having an open mind about life and and staying out of all the political discussion, at least publicly, right, I mean.

Absolutely. Well, most of it anyway.

Yeah, the US is a bit of a a mess, especially at time of this record after last night. Right? So I mean.

Yeah. Last night’s debate, though. Can I just say my girl did a good job.

Hi.

I like her.

You too.

I I hope she wins, but this House is ready for.

It’s the same.

For for making history, so to speak. So.

Well. We we did it once. We could do it again. We’ve actually, we’ve done it twice. This would be the third time, right? So we had a black president, we had a black woman vice president. Now let’s make her president, too. That’s all I’m going.

Yeah. Saw, yeah, we said. Yeah.

To say politically.

You you can say that it’s OK. We’ve had already Prime Minister in this country as Leader of Canada. We have had lady premiers, which for those who don’t know, it’s like the governor in the US. They kind of they run the province. We’ve had lady premiers. So I’m.

OK.

I don’t think, I think. We’re a little more open, unrepresented sometimes and maybe I’m wrong. I don’t know if people know if you go back in history, Jackie Robinson had to go place my new League Baseball for the Dodgers outside Of Montreal. Because there’s racial problems in the US. So the Dodgers sent him to Canada.

Hmm.

Wife for the Montreal Royals, which was a Dodgers farm team to get him away from all the political messes in the states in the day. So. I think I think as Canadians were probably wrong, but I think we’re a little more open than some parts of the world and I can’t remember. Have you been to Toronto?

Yep.

The business sector.

Oh, many times, yes.

Yeah, so you know Toronto’s at the United Nations, right? And and I mean, I I don’t say that lightly. There’s it’s the communities. And then there’s, for example, we have one of the biggest Jewish populations in the world outside of Israel and Montreal in Canada. We have probably the biggest Indian population in North America and north of Toronto.

Mm-hmm.

I mean, and I’m not saying it’s wrong, it’s just we are a diverse city and that’s just the reality of it all. So that’s not bad.

I love diversity. No, it’s great.

I know you do. Everything about diversity is if you embrace the cultures and as you know, I have an Italian partner and I make no bones about that and you get involved in the other cultures.

Mm-hmm.

The food, the culture, the experience. I didn’t alone is worth doing right.

Absolutely that we could learn so much from. And you know, I always say if you have a more diverse, inclusive community, then you are able to, I mean at the very bottom, if you want to be purely selfish about it, you have a bigger audience to sell to, right, because you have more people and more perspectives involved in the steps of the process, but. It’s just, it’s just. Better. We’re better when we work together on things.

No question, OK. UM. They’ve been kind of. All over the space, there’s something you want to try. You haven’t, right? That’s.

Something I want to try and I haven’t tried.

In the workplace space or in the marketing space or?

So so I have bucket lists and my bucket list is about most people. Most people have bucket lists of doing daredevil things or visiting certain. Trees, whatever my bucket list is a little different. It’s places I want to speak, and so I have now spoken on the stage twice at where Camp Asia I had. I’m I am a speaker for word camp us next week. I’m very excited about that. But I haven’t spoke at your WordPress Europe yet, so that’s one of my bucket list things. So I want to speak at work. Europe and then I also want to do a Ted talk. I think it doing a Ted talk would be really cool.

Yeah, it sounds like a great idea. Yeah. You know, you know, it’s funny. You’re right. Like, I think about my bucket list and the few places I want to go on it. There’s other stuff like. Things I wanna wanna wanna do in life. Things I want to achieve in life and that’s stuff that’s that’s very important to me I mean.

Yeah.

And you and I are both. You’ve been through a lot losing your father in the last couple of years and things like that. We’re both pretty family oriented. And I think that matters too. Like there really is.

Yeah, for sure.

Absolutely.

And your love outside your WordPress photography, right?

I love photography. Yes, I’ve got several cameras. I I was overjoyed when I could buy a second camera body, so I didn’t have to. When I go out in nature, keep switching the lenses and letting so much more dust in the camera body. But yeah, so like, I’ve got my home decorated.

Change your energies, yeah.

Behind me on the wall is like 25, I think 25 photos that I’ve taken. You can’t see the other wall. That’s got another nine over here. And the ones that’s got another 12 in. Bedroom. Because if I thought it was pretty, take a picture of I may as well hang it on my wall. Right? So I absolutely adore getting out in nature. Almost every photo was taken from my car because I don’t walk and so I don’t. I can’t go, you know, hiking for example. So I find I find nature paths that are car. Friendly and you know, go places like that and find find nature to take photos of. And then I’ve got some really nice aerial shots, but I don’t have a drone. So they’re just out of a plane window. So when I’m flying into places, I’m sitting at the window looking to see if there’s anything to take a picture of on the way down.

I love photography. I got interested in photography when the digital age hit. If I did it with film, I guarantee the film with a sat in a corner for months and months and months and now.

Yeah, I think that’s great.

And now I’m the guy who goes out with we have a family event on Sunday at 2:00, there’s families fall, picnic. I guarantee you I’ll be the guy that shoots 200 pictures on. Sunday. Ohh it’s easy to do. Now I probably won’t take my Sony DSLR I have. One, I’ll probably take a smartphone. Some of them are really good. I went out about 8 months ago and bought one of these really good smartphone gimbals that actually rotates, so it’s and they go and they’re they’re they’re up on their bucks for a good one. But you know what? I didn’t carry a a Sony DSLR on a walking trip. When they tell you.

Hmm. You’re nice. Worth it?

Yeah.

When I travel, it’s I shoot with my phone. I have an iPhone. When I travel, that’s all I bring cause with my scooter and my backpack and my, you know, my luggage, carrying another bag full of cameras is a lot to do. But when I’m out in nature and I’m in my car, I’ve got 2 cannons. I have a Canon rebel T5 and a Canon Rebel T7, and I have an Olympus mirrorless.

Are you sure?

What I’m learning to use still.

Yeah. And you got a few lenses to go with it, I think.

I have more lenses than I can. Count I think at this point.

I I.

I’ve been gifted for quite a few which? Is a blessing.

Yeah, it is. They are pricey. I have a friend whose cousin is a digital buyer by 1 of volunteers. Biggest camera chains. So thank God because I’d be done if I wasn’t. I’ve got a, you know, the telephoto lens that the pros used to shoot action sports. I have one of those, and it’s just.

Yeah, for sure.

Yeah.

I want one.

Yes, and it took me like a year and a half to get to use it. And as you know, you were talking about drones. I’m working on shooting from the Internet now. That’s my latest project, so.

Hello.

Yeah, that’s pretty cool, I think.

People who don’t shoot photography don’t understand. The value of it I mean and I think the hardest part is hopefully you go to a friend’s house. They’ve been away, say, Cuba, and they start showing pictures and because you weren’t there, you don’t appreciate the pictures the same way as the person who was there, right. And I think that that’s part of the problem. But on the other hand?

1. Mm-hmm.

And by the way, if you want pictures of Niagara Falls like I must have about 3000 or so.

I’ve got a got a. Few in the WordPress photo directory myself from when I did the tunnel tour that you turned me on to, yeah.

You you like that, didn’t you? You have really, like amazing. Yeah.

It was awesome. It was awesome. For sure. Can I tell you my my least favorite thing? Like, I love everybody loves compliments. Right? When somebody loves your photography, that makes you feel good. Nobody loves your writing, makes you feel good. But my least favorite compliment with the air quotes is wow, those are great pictures. You must have a wonderful camera.

Your meeting.

So my response to that now is, well, you’re a really great writer. You must have a fantastic laptop.

Yeah. What they don’t understand. One of my favorite pictures was one I took about nine years ago. Was taken off the skyline tower in Niagara Falls, so the viewing area on the skyline tower is all mesh and get a camera in between the lenses.

Mm-hmm.

It was taken on a point and shoot, not even a. Cell phone. And it’s and it’s facing the Rainbow Bridge and. I’ve got the maid of the mist in the water and I’ve got a rainbow in the background in a Rainbow Bridge, and everybody who sees that photo says. Where did you steal the postcard? I said.

Nice, nice. Yeah.

And and it was taken in January, Michelle, with -25°C, you wouldn’t know it from the photo, but it is the.

Yes.

Yeah, clear air though.

Yeah, it was clear air and it was just out of this world. So I think the reason you’ve become a good photographer in your hobby is you take a lot of pictures and the best way.

Wonderful.

To get better. Is take your camera and just go shoot. Very simple. I don’t care which your phone shoot.

Also yeah.

But but study light and study the rule of thirds and understand how to frame a photo and what the horizon is, and all of those things light. Light is the most important. The word photography has photo as its as its root, and that means light. So you know it’s it’s lighting, lighting with light photograph. And so you have to understand light and to get a really good.

Horizon. The. Yeah.

Hello. But yeah, if you understand some of the basic principles, just get out there and practice, practice, practice like I look back at my my when I first got my cameras 8 years ago and I was like, I thought those pictures. Were phenomenal and they were. Good. But they are not anywhere near what I take today because I have a much more discerning eye and understand my equipment much better.

Yep, so true. But that’s photography. Would you like to? In there and I used to work in air quotes spare time.

OK, so if I really just want to kick back and relax, I’m laying on my couch with something on Hulu and TikTok in my hand because that is a just a mind escape and a.

Yeah, I’ve heard you say that before, yeah.

Way for me to totally relax. Love, love, love it. But I love crossword puzzles, so I’ve got a couple of apps. Like people, I don’t have to play games like you’re talking about games before. Well, I think before we started recording like video games and things. Like that. But I love. Of I love word games like I like Scrabble. I like crossword puzzles. I do. I do probably three to five sudokus a day, just things that keep my mind active but don’t require a lot of brain power.

My partner’s family is an old style games family. Board games, board games and more.

Yeah.

Yes.

You guys are all competitive. So you know, it’s like the short.

I’m only competing against the phone.

It’s like the it’s like the sharks eating the sharks that family get togethers. It’s just it’s and you just have. You just have to be there. It’s. That’s all I can say and then I will say the sharpest 1 is her 86 year old Father. He is like.

That’s not against other people. Yeah, that’s funny. I understand, yeah.

There you go.

And I’m being sneaky. And fun and fun, I should tell.

There you go.

You that so yeah.

Scrabble, Boggle, and crossword puzzles are my favorite, but I will play Yahtzee too on my phone.

So there’s a timeless game, right? That’s going on forever. Hey, Michelle. Thanks for talking about everything you do. I think you could, listeners and viewers, a bit of an insight. We all know you’re busy. So it kind of fun stuff too.

Yeah, for sure.

Yes.

I think lifes import. I want to personally thank you for making our community a better place I and more importantly, thank you for your friendship. I appreciate that more than you realize.

No, thank you. Likewise.