Episode 446 SEO and PPC For Your Business With Ryan Waterbury

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Show Summary

Rob Cairns and Ryan Waterbury talk about SEO and PPC for your Business.

Show Highlights:

1. When to use SEO or PPC. 2. We need to look at other advertising networks besides Facebook and Google. 3. Local SEO still matters. 4. PPC is the shortest distance to ROI.

• When to use SEO or PPC?
• We need to look at other advertising networks besides Facebook and Google.
• Local SEO still matters.
• PPC is the shortest distance to ROI.

Show Notes

Hey everybody. Rob Cairns here and today I have my monthly co-host Mr. Ryan Waterbury, and I’m coming to you from hot, hot, hot, not Atlanta, but Toronto as we speak, because we have humidex warnings in effect once again this summer to go with the forest fires. West, which we won’t talk about. Hey, Ryan. How’s life?

About the same in Minneapolis, MN, where almost Canada and feeling the heat and the forest fires out West.

You know, we’re not. We haven’t got the smoke yet from out West, but it’s coming. And I gotta tell you, I have a brother who lives in Fort, Saskatchewan, Edmonton just outside of Edmonton, AB, and they’re getting all the smoke from their Jasper fires. And it’s Jasper’s pretty a bad site right now. To be honest, it’s kinda decimated.

It’s pretty rough all across Western US and Canada right now for wildfire.

Yeah, I think it’s just the state that we had another dry winter and dry winters do not help forest fires. I will tell any.

You know I it it was delayed because of all of our torrential rains throughout the spring, thankfully.

So.

And we’ve had, we’ve had rain in Ontario. So we we’ve got a couple forest fires up north, but we’re going to get some rain. So let’s jump into some more agency stuff, ongoing discussions. Around SEO and TPC paper. And I’m thinking I wanna tackle paper clip 1st and I’m kinda doing a bit. So we all know the fastest way to ROI to find a budget and buy some Max. And we know that paper clip. Now there’s multiple ways of doing paper click. You can do Google ads you can do.

Mm-hmm.

Facebook ads you can go to sites like Reddit now offers April cook ads. Believe it or not, they have a partner program. If anybody’s interested, Yelp certainly offers paper click ads and so on and so on. The hardest thing it used to be, people wrote back in the day. Systems were get somewhere for $10 a day or $20 a day. I do not believe you can do it on $20 a day and one of the reasons is the Fortune 500 companies has discovered what TPC is. And they’ve got endless marketing budgets. What’s your thought on PPC and announcement?

Ah, there’s a lot of thoughts on. That. And it’s been. It’s been challenging finding. Budget. Where to serve your ads and how to serve your ads. I mean, I I just had a Facebook memory pop up from, I think 2022 or 2021 when I did a a show with our friend Todd Jones on. Cookie marketing being gone and you could very vigilantly and and hyper target people that visited your site when you would drop a cookie in their browser and you could follow them around the web. That was great and those $10 budgets went a long way because.

Oh yes, I remember that show.

You showed your ad very specifically to people that were already engaged with your site, your product, your app. And you could do things like that now, with privacy being a concern because the wrong guy won in 2016. We’ve had some privacy reformed that we can’t. We can’t drop a cookie on you and spy on you like we used to be able to. So we have to take more time and.

Yes.

Do things all it manually and.

But hope.

Ohh God thought for it.

That really comes down to. Budget and when you mentioned.

Hold on. Hold on. Hold for a second, but with Whoopies. Not to jump in for a second interrupt you, but Google just announced they are still gonna allow third party cookies this past week or the last two days, so that might change that whole landscape, right?

Mm-hmm. So the Google’s gone through a few renditions like Flock, where they you belong to a group of cohorts.

Mm-hmm.

WordPress folks said no, we don’t want you to do that. We value our privacy. They shut that down. Googles continued to try and gather data so they can continue serving ads and making money. What has really come down to and AI comes into that. We’ll talk about that later, but I still do PPC for clients. I had taken a little bit of time off and focused on web design development, but back in, in the saddle, doing PPC and Holy cow when I see. Yeah. A large competitor increase their budget. I we know right away because all of a sudden we’ll have no conversions for a few days and we’re just being outspent because our ads stopped showing and. That is a problem when you compare with some of the big boys, they have a larger budget, so we have to get creative and the the targeting that we have without cookies. It gets a little trickier on how we remark and how we get get educated on where to spend our budget, and it gets tough. So the little guys often get locked out and they end up spending. Loads more money than they used to have to do to even just start to find their audio.

I agree with you. The other thing I would say and we I didn’t include it as one the top two, but you and I talked about this year day this week is we need to get. Businesses. Terrible local SEO.

Who?

Creating Google business profiles and they need to do it now and then on top of the Google business profile they need to go and create a Bing places. What is it? Bing my business or Bing places profile same thing.

But.

Yeah.

They need to create one of those and I know the business owner is gonna argue and say that’s one more thing. I’m gonna maintain. No, you set it up. You say sink it from my Google business profile every 24 hours, and people are gonna say, well, Microsoft, that’s a waste of time. And I would argue because the copilot and the work world.

It’s very brilliant.

Edge is being used more and more. If you looked at the browser percentages edges going up, by the way, Firefox is dying by the day again and it’s just going up bit by bit by bit and I think well because the copilot and because of that. They’re more relevant and I’ll give you a bit of a. An analysis about a guy who’s a good friend who’s got to do his story and you and. I have talked about him all. Although many times and on. SEO Local SEO, he ranked right now in his city’s third for jewelry stores and out of so he’s on first page his. Google Business pages on first page and interesting means out ranking Michael Hill. Which is a multinational in Canada in the US and he’s out ranking them. They called peoples doors. Who’s a multinational in Canada because of his Google business profile. So Google business profiles matter for local search because people who search you, the two things they want, is to call you. And they go see you almost right. Away. What do you think about that?

I it’s not. It’s not always just your Google business profile, but the fact that people are doing things on mobile and when we talk about mobile first. The browser automatically knows that you’re on mobile. It has GPS location, so it maps automatically ties in it, especially if you’re on Android. In North America, iPhone is more prevalent around the world. You know, we said some more Android use. Yep. So either way, Google is still the search engine of choice on either device, and by default you’re going to tie into Google.

Android for problems.

Maps. Absolutely. If you have a Google business profile, you’re going to get some visibility, but Google likes when you use their products. And you know, we keep hearing about zero click and what that means is. You’re staying on.google.com to get your information either from AI from a maps listing and or something that’s above the search listings, and that’s what your Google business profile will do. It’s not, it’s now a part of Google Maps and that ties into proximity now with. Mobile traffic being about 2/3 of the web these days, especially in North America.

Yep.

That’s right.

Your your local business profile absolutely cannot rank national profiles because you have a stronger presence as your primary location. The other trick to that, and this ties in with some holistic SEO blog right, write good content on your site and then post those links and and share it to all your other platforms. Facebook X.

Yep.

Interest, that was 11 search engine that you left off that offers ads for PC that can be offered depending underneath, but don’t forget to post things, get updates to your Google business profile even if very few people look at those. That’s an indicator to Google that you’re an active business and that.

That’s true, dagan.

You care about your profile and that you’re enriching it, and that will give you an increase in in search rankings.

I know.

Yeah. I would also add, we’re talking about vendor businesses that don’t have any controversy. So businesses like CBP. Cannabis adult entertainment we if it’s legal guns very much so they all have health stuff. They all have different rules around them when they’re doing that. And certainly our friend Mr. Donald Trump has caused Facebook to rewrite.

OK.

All their political ads, and by the way.

Those rules go.

To politicians and candidate too. And it’s such a pain in the, you know, where I don’t even wanna talk about it because I still clean it. I still play in that space and it is complicated and it is.

Exactly.

Uh.

It is complicated and I’ve completely pulled out of the political advertising and SEO game and any work in that realm because the rules we know Google changes the rules for SEO. You know it used to be a couple of times here. They do now go up to it now. It’s used to be, you know twice. Announce quarterly sometimes every other month, maybe every three weeks. You know, we have enough rule changes in in that realm to worry about the hyper specific political rules, but. You know, it’s not as bad as you think. Some things did loosen up. I think Google and Facebook realized that they went a little hard after the 2016 election. I did some advertising in that next cycle or two, and each successive cycle, I think they rolled back a few things that were made it too. Difficult to advertise, so it’s still doable but. You gotta get verified. There’s just a few extra hoops to jump through.

No, I I I. Agree with you. And by the way, the verification. Now they’re saying can take up to six months. So you gotta do it early. So if you’re trying to get verified for this year’s. US political campaign, right. If you’re trying to get verified for next year’s Federal Canadian campaign, I suggest if you’re out there and listening, you should do it now. Like, honestly, because if you wait till January, you’ll be coming to me and I’ll be saying to you, I can’t help you. Sorry.

So I want to talk about PPC and and how you know it can work and SCL, especially when we were talking about local and I’m going to give you an example of one of my clients that it absolutely makes sense to do PPC and. And why? So I have a local contractor that does historic restoration so that that that really when we look at the construction around our metro area and if you have our older cities surrounding our metro, there’s very specific neighborhoods that.

Oh.

That the buildings were built in that that this company services.

MHM.

So what that does is it allows us to geofence and by doing that we already know that we have specific areas that we can we can place ads and show them to people in those areas. So PC when we’re doing things like that and in certain scenarios. Those makes perfect sense and you don’t have to spend those thousands of dollars. I it helps because the other guys that want to do just general replacement and construction, they’re spending lots of money. But in this instance, we’re spending just in these areas and we’re beating the big guys. So.

Yeah, no questions.

When you look at businesses. Each niche and business is going to be a little bit differently and you have to find that competitive advantage, whether it’s geofencing to make sure that your ad spend goes farther. But what I’m really talking about is that we’re targeting and we’re cutting down our audience and we’re narrowing down our audience.

Hmm.

So in in order to make your dollar go further. You’re not spending and letting Google figure out who your audience is. You’re taking the time and doing the research ahead and doing a little bit of competitor and market research. We always do this, but it’s even more important to do that now because we don’t have the cookie we aren’t tracking. The machine learning isn’t as accurate as it used to be, and when it does. Trip on something. It could be a bunch of bad leads or a bunch of bad clicks when it’s it’s a, it’s a trick or something that that trips your your click that isn’t relevant so.

I want you talking about a competitor this past week who who clicked on your clicked on an ad without naming the client multiple times and was causing your clients ad spend to go up.

I.

Go down.

Yeah, absolutely. So that’s happened a couple of times and there are there are ways to avoid it and combat that like we can talk about that in a of a future podcast. But it happens where competitors will click on your ad repeatedly to blow up your ad spend and use up your ad spend.

You should.

So that your ad stopped showing and only their ads to. You. It’s I I liken that to Black Hat SEO or it just. Other shady tactics out there, and people do it. Other agencies do it. I think that this is just one of those unethical things that gives people.

They hire, they hire VH. The higher VA’s to do a lot of unethical stuff and out of the Philippines and pay them almost nothing, including writing fake reviews. By the way, too they if if I looked.

A bad name. Exactly, yes.

Up. At my spam box again this morning. Believe it or not, I had five requests and they’re saying can I write? Some fake reviews. They don’t say fake reviews, reviews and X dollars review and I’m like. You do realize these are fake? You do realize when Google sees these, you’re screwed. You do realize this is a bad idea, right? Right.

Absolutely. And that’s, you know, some of these shady tactics. People don’t realize that if you get a black strike, you can’t use a platform anymore. You, you know all too well with Facebook. That’s happened when.

No.

Ohh I don’t need money.

When your domain gets blacklisted, you you’re done, and if your audience happens to be on that platform. You’re kind of screwed.

And I should I should tell you I’m not blacklisted anymore for some reason. So I just you gotta write it out. And there’s no point in appealing. And there’s they they say all you can appeal the the AI is useless when it comes to appealing. So there’s no point in appealing. There’s no point in going anywhere. There’s no point in doing anything. That’s just the way it is.

So here’s an interesting thing and I I want to touch on since we’re still talking about Google Business profile. But remember when Elon purchased Twitter and now it’s acts and one of the things that he wanted to do away was was all the spam ads. And he said, hey, where, why, why don’t we do, you know, premium profiles and you?

Poop.

You get very right.

By the way. Let’s stop there from it. Translation pay Twitter for ads instead of putting out your own spam ads so we can make more money off you. So let let’s clarify that real quickly, right?

That, that too, but I’m talking.

You got me.

About here but where? You where you have a subscription different and you know you’re paying for extra features.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

So you know, Google has floated the paid business profile before. And we’ve been talking about Google for PC here for a minute, but Meta took a page, took a page from Access book and and Elon said, hey, we’re going to do verify and you we’re going to charge you for that and you. Get some things for it. Well, we all know how terrible meta has been when you have problems with that, you know.

Ohh terrible awful. Go away, yeah.

What you you. You send an e-mail into the abyss and you stare into it and you wait for something back that never comes back and you never get an answer back. That’s why.

Or or or. Or form e-mail back that says we’re looking into it and that’s the last thing you hear.

But here’s the interesting thing with the new meta verified, they have different tiers, and starting with the first tier is you get your verified badge. But here, here’s the here’s to that. Enhance support, chat or e-mail with agents and where you actually have a person and now they have monthly tiers up which allow you to add multiple profiles. So if you’re a marketer and you’re managing a lot on meta, this is basically paying for a support plan. Where? Shoot here. I’m looking 88 profiles a month, 350 per month for to be able to talk to a Rep and get 300 and 4999 and.

Dollars. $0.50 a month, right? 99 today only.

Then this is for today, but you you can actually get through to an agent now if if you’re one of those large PPC agencies and doing a lot of business, that would be extremely beneficial or even if you’re not at that level yet and you’re not doing the ad spend to already have a Rep assigned to you. This might be something you know worthwhile. Google has been very good with, with offering support calls, but I will tell you. They’re not support calls. They’re like a trip to the mechanic where you have one piece broken and they’re going to upsell you to spend more money. Every one of the Yep, every one of Google’s recommendations is.

You don’t. Their sales.

Will help you. Don’t get me wrong, you will see increased conversions and clicks but.

But you need to spend more money.

You need to spend more money, so when we, you know when we talk about the the ad companies and that’s what they are. They’re marketing platforms, that’s what Facebook is. That’s what Google is. They’re masquerading as, you know, a social media platform and a search engine. But they’re marketing platforms first and foremost.

So is Reddit, so is Reddit, by the way.

And when we? Absolutely and and run it. You know you run it back to the day, you know, it was chock full of. Google ads all over, and you know that’s how they, you know, funded the platform. Now they have native ads and they’ve struck a deal with Google where they’ve blocked every other AI search engine except for Google. And they said here you get our content, nobody else does. It’s. It’s becoming a pay to play Ave. for everything from PPC to SEO and. So we need to kind of shift that conversation, not, not necessarily from PPC, but we need to talk about how it relates to SEO and the fact that. That big leak that happened earlier this year for the Google algorithm, there were things in there that, you know, I had missed and I was made aware of, but most of it we already kind of knew what those things were and and and some of those things made sense for what we were already doing. But what really came down to is a click is a click, is a click and it it doesn’t matter if it comes from a paid click or an organic click. It’s from the Chrome user data and.

That’s true.

That was interesting, where you had talked about those Fortune 500 companies spending. 10s of thousands of dollars on PPC a month. How many clicks do you think they get out of that?

Yeah, not not as many as you would think. Yeah, it’s interesting. When we look at books and, you know, Fortune 5, hundreds don’t always get the same clicks unless they’re doing something special. So I remember I like to commuters to a A plus size clothing chain in Canada back in the day. Disclaimer, at one time I did some work with them. So I I can. That’s what that’s going out there. I didn’t do their PPC. Company called additional, they’re not in business anymore. They were owned by the Whitman family out Of Montreal and one of the things they used to get was mega clicks. But it was and they’re they’re a fortunate, considered Fortune 500. The right man. Families got some big money in retailing in Canada, but. What they did really well was they created a legion of raving fans, so all the raving fan ladies who used to buy. Goes from them. Would click on their ads, so that’s a little different, because then you’ve created a bit of a community and when you get those ads fed to you on Facebook or fed to you on a website that you’re watching, you’re gonna click on them because you’re gonna say ohh I’ve already shopped there. So that’s warm traffic and warm. Affect. There’s a whole new ball game, right?

Oh, absolutely. It’s somebody’s interested, then it it, it makes more sense to remarket to them. And that’s where that’s where cookies were invaluable, where we knew what. What product you looked at on our site and at what time. And we could show you ads. Related to that all over now it’s a little trickier with pixel blocking, but it’s doable.

It’s hard, yeah.

So it it gets more difficult. So when you visit a website and you’re logged in on your browser to meta and Google. You browse and you you find a product that you like and you come back to meta. Meta is a is about discovery where. All, let’s say I’m actually drinking black rifle coffee and I was on their side to order some more the other day and I came back to meta. Looked down and all I saw were ads for different copies. I didn’t see a black rifle coffee, one for a while. I did eventually, but I saw all sorts of different ads from other advertisers because they didn’t. They knew I was looking at coffee so. Everyone in the kitchen sink, whether it was a perfect match up showed up in my feet immediately.

Google’s a little different, though. They also track ads, especially if you’ve got a Pixel phone.

And then.

I hate to tell you. I was looking the other day and Google’s got this really cool feature. If you have geolocation turned on called the guide feature and I think you know what that is right when you travel around town and I do so much walking that I’m always in my area ranked. In the top 5% of the guides I always have and and they all go through and it’s pretty accurate. They’ll say you were at this store, you were at this store, you. Were at this store. And then Google to go with that has a really cool feature called Google Rewards. I think you’re aware of that where you go fill out the survey. Well, they’re feeding you those surveys based on where your Google Guide is telling you where you’re going. Now, I always do them because frankly, Google already knows where I’ve been and who cares and that they’re going to send me free money. To pay my Google bills, go ahead guys. I’ll take the free money every time. Like for an app for. Or a Google Play purchase. But but honestly like that’s how they do it. And it’s even more prevalent on pixel phones more than anything. Now. That all said, I would not give up my Pixel phone. My Pixel 7 for the world. This is the third Pixel 4th pixel I’ve had. So I’ve had a 6AA4A. The three. I wouldn’t give up my pixel unless unless I could get a Xiaomi phone in Canada that works fine. That would be the exception Shomi’s doing some really cool stuff overseas right now, but they are Chinese based, which means they’re not allowed here.

Yeah, that’s a little bit that’s spying for the for the other team, apparently.

Yeah, but who cares? Google and Facebook are.

Spying, anyway, So what does it matter anymore?

You know it. It it? Yeah. It’s just who do you want to give your data to? It’s bound to. And honestly, yeah, everybody’s buying.

That’s right. That’s right. They keep saying.

Except if you’re on a Linux box like a true Linux box, then then you’re in a whole different world. But I I’m on my third pixel. I love them. I think they’re great phones. They’ve had some of the best specs out there, but you want to try it into Google. I’m signed, signed into multiple Google accounts on there. One is my old old.

Comma.

Female personal account from when I was first invited in into the program in the early 2000s from a college friend that worked at Google and. So that local guide account is is pretty hefty and I think one of the one of the photos I have of bud my office manager is at our vet and that photo in their office has more views than any any other part to their business profile.

What? Yeah.

Because it’s been up there so long and and.

Yeah, but. But it’s funny. It’s so funny because, you know, the guide program in. School. But you?

No.

And and you and I have talked to, I have talked about this and it’s who do you trust with your data and I would rather trust Google than Facebook with my data #1 number. I hate to say it, folks, but that’s where I stand and #2 is as as somebody who’s in and. I tried to pull fully out of Google this year. It does.

Work.

It does not work no matter how people talk about the Google filing and they say, oh, you can create a local photo storage system on an as you can do this, you can do that. Well, your your problem, what do you do about? AI. What do you do about and? And as you know, I’m deep in the Gemini right now in a big way. So what do you do about Gemini? What do you do about Google’s AI for photos, which I think is the best on the Internet. I’ve had problems with other photo services so. You know, despite all the data they do a lot.

Yes.

Of good things like, honestly.

So yeah, it’s interesting that you mentioned the pixel and we talked about AI, and I will come back to PC and why I don’t like AI in there in a minute. But I just happened to pick up a Pixel 9 because. And I had Pixel 6, so I happened to drop it and the screen cracked. So I’m looking 8 Pro at last year’s model. It was slightly discounted, but it’s a great phone. It is one of the phones that out-of-the-box does not have Google Assistant. It is fully Gemini and I.

Oh, OK.

Built in with the right when I opened the box. And I I you know, from a privacy focused person, it does bother me a little bit, but I’m gonna tell you I agree with you. The convenience of hitting the bottom button and having Google lens come up and actually integrate and fully into the AI to.

Yep.

What is this and tell me about? Google’s been doing this a little longer than open AI and ChatGPT, so they’re leaning on their index search data, and the results I get back are better. And then ChatGPT, when I, you know, compare Jim and I to ChatGPT. So that’s where I’m tied in with the. I agree with you.

Why don’t so, since we’re talking about AI, why don’t you like AI and PC? What’s going on?

Semi is a good tool. So AI and PC? Like like we said, Google likes to spend money and what I’m seeing is I’ve been testing a couple of ad sets that. Work with AI, the leads that we’re getting back on two different ad sets, two different clients, two different niches similar but not identical. Aren’t as good as when we have manual attention and control of the account. Now, that’s not to say that we’re not using AI and machine learning in those campaigns, but we are very specifically directing it and not just blanket letting the account do what it. Wants. Because Google like. They open with. They want to make money. While they won’t get results, they are going to charge you astronomically for those results and the results may not be as good as what you get with. Directing and some early tests that I’ve been doing over the. Past two to three. Months and I’m going to be wrapping that up in a case study here shortly, but. You you need some hands on and you know AI at the outset, a lot of people were worried that, hey, it’s going to take our jobs, you know, particularly copywriting advertising. But I’m going to tell you everything that I’ve seen and worked with on the back end of.

I don’t agree.

Meta I campaigns and Google AI campaigns. They’re not there yet, and for the average advertiser, it adds another layer of complexity. I I should say average business owner trying to do ads that. It may look great on the surface, but you’re going to spend a lot of money and get very few results if you don’t know the platform it’s that’s just kind of the sad fact of where we’re at that instead of making things easier, we’re at the point where it’s still growing and learning, but it’s making things more difficult in, in my experience.

Yeah, let’s jump on to. Feel. And you and I have some similar opinions and we different opinions. So I think it’s. Fair I think. We were talking before and I think what I meant to say is that SEO isn’t worthwhile doing. I just think it’s harder and harder and harder to do it today. Now one of the reasons I encourage small businesses to do the. Google My Business page and the Bing my big the big pages is that helps Ocasio. We all know that. I think the. Problem is, businesses are impatient when they think about it, so they’re not prepared to wait for three months or four months for results to take. And let’s be honest, we’re filling that fray. But the other thing is. They think businesses don’t set their websites up well. So good technical designers and developers aren’t always good SEO people. So for example, I looked at a website recently. And you know which one? I’m not going to mention it. It had 1000 images that had no alt things in the images. And he wondered why he wasn’t getting any search traffic on any of his products. Well, I can tell you why.

That’s probably not the only thing that was missing.

Oh. Ohh, we don’t wanna go there. Here. Anyway, where do you sit on SEO these days?

I you know, I, I I still do a lot of SEO and it I honestly I’ve had interments results depending on the niche and that that’s changed where Google. Google is still the the go to you know when we talk about who sets rules and specific industries post COVID especially have gotten hit when we talk about anything medically related the they’ve they’ve made a change where it said no here are trusted sources only national organizations.

No.

Yada yada yada. And if you’re if you’re in those niches, you got to work a lot harder. And honestly, that’s where you make the.

Tell me.

Pigeon to say.

Tell me about.

Yeah, that’s where you have to make the decision to say maybe we should look at PPC versus SEO to get to the top of the page.

I agree that I agree.

But. But let’s look at related industries and we talked about health insurance or life insurance and working with clients in that niche. We’re doing some basic SEO. You know, after doing the good technical SEO like you said, getting your meta descriptions, optimize your child tags, optimized, making sure there’s good UX on the site. Alt tags with the images. Seeing above there and then starting to do the the good on page content building topic clusters. Doing those things in one of the. Non censored niches or or rounds. I think it’s still worthwhile, but again you need to look at what the business is and what the rules are. And so when I talk about Google changing the rules all the time. You gotta sit down and almost monthly take your business and see you. What rules have changed and does this strategy still make sense?

Yeah, any time in the censored niches, you might unfortunately be looking at other.

So with my.

Ad networks and things like that, like I know I have a couple. Clients and that that old entertainment and that’s through the legal side of it and you’re forever looking at different ad networks, non Google search ad networks, non Google ways because frankly they just sit there, it’s it’s ridiculous and these are businesses that are 100%.

Sure.

Legal. And 100% not doing anything wrong and that’s just the way it is.

I yeah. And I and I work with that with the CBD and the the TC, the cannabis industry as a whole and Yep, and I’ve done PPC and really what it comes down to is even SEO gets difficult because.

It’s hard, same problem.

FDA and state regulations vary from each each area where you are allowed to only say certain things on your site, and this is in the your money, your life category where that’s another category that’s highly censored and regulated where you have to really step back.

No.

Build a strategy. On first and foremost where where can I find my clients and how can I connect with them? And then you have to choose? Where are you going to advertise and how are you going to write your content? So that’s where SEO in those industries comes in. Well, even at the adult industry all the time, but certainly for health as well.

Let’s go back to that. Yeah, I wanted to go there. I did work years ago with a client. Who was in health and Wellness? And these rules haven’t changed that much. And one of the things you’re not Google frowns on this when you start making guarantees 50 percent, 40% even on your website or SEO penalize you for that. And I kept saying to him, you can’t do that. And he’s like, but I want to do that. I don’t care. And I kept saying.

Absolutely.

1. What do you want me to do? Like.

Yeah. And I have a client that. We were very careful about which ads we put on Google Merchant Center. Thankfully, they’re revamping that and the programs new again, so we’re going to reapply. But once you, once you tripped that flag, I talked about getting banned. It’s very hard to get off their blacklist. Google, Facebook, it doesn’t matter. You know, those two platforms.

It’s awful.

Also, where most people hang out and where you’re gonna find the most PC value. You.

What what I would say to you too is having investigated some other sources, you should probably you’re right, you should look at Pinterest. They have a massive agency partner program. I haven’t looked into it lately. I’ve certainly been in discussion with the folks that read it. Right now I’m running a couple. That campaigns that are good, they, Reddit base and those numbers are coming out pretty reasonable. For the cost. So that’s another Ave. they have a large partner program. I know Yelp does. I’m not a big fan of Yelp, but if you’re in that restaurant hospitality industry, you probably want to be there. So you might want to think about it no matter how much I like or hate them. It’s another story. So I mean, what we’re saying is Ryan and I are talking about Google and Facebook, but don’t discount the other platforms as well because.

No, not at all. And those platforms may be the only spots that you can honestly advertise. And so that’s what when I talk about, you need to look at your industry and you know first and foremost find your audience.

They could be just.

If you if you have a. All business that’s you know, holistic healing. You might want to look at Pinterest for advertising because you know, a lot of people will use that search engine and pinned home remedies and within their stack of pens, you can slide in and add. And that’s a perfect placement for someone that that. Me need something pre-made where they they’ve been looking on how to do it. Themselves DIY to DIY spots like Pinterest to finding your solution. That solves a problem for them. It’s a great spot. So yeah, Google and Facebook are the big ones, but the other. But the other search engines out there, Yelp was one, you know, we talked about Reddit. It’s it’s a forum and a search engine all on its own. And and you know, especially Pinterest, I’ve seen some good results there depending on the niche.

I have a. I have a new client who’s physical therapist and I think at rest is probably gonna be the where we go just because of that needs. That’s where people go for that under stuff.

Even from an SEO standpoint, pin your blogs to a board on Pinterest that’s a back link and Google sees that as a backlink. So the more it you know we we talk about, you know, other marketers. Ross Simmons is one. He says great once distribute indefinitely. And the nice thing is. Posting on your blog to Google My Business, your Facebook page, your Pinterest page, your ex profile, every everywhere that that you have a profile that allows you to make regular updates.

This.

Gives you back links and also gives you more visibility back to your site. That’s you know where we can kind of game some of these systems and. Use their strength and visibility. To drive traffic back to our site but not pay for those PPC clicks and. You know, so it’s all tied together. You you really need to sit down and and figure out. What are the rules around advertising your product and where is my audience? So those are my biggest tips are figure out where your audience is and figure out what the rules of that platform are and then build a strategy around it and it might be that you can’t run paid ads on that platform.

OK.

Now and then.

Well then, then you have to plan for that.

And then figure out and then figure out your audience. You need to figure out your customer avatar and you know that’s that’s a discussion for another show. But I think we should do. But I think a lot of people know don’t even know what their ideal customer is. And without that, you can’t do your audience. And without that, you can’t serve proper ads. Rest of you, honestly.

Exactly. Really. Today it you can’t just throw money or throw spaghetti at the wall with random content. You’re. You really need to be efficient and effective with your marketing to make your dollar and your time go farther. And by doing that you have to do the planning upfront. That’s more important today than it ever has been.

So true. Hey, Ryan, as always, thanks for joining me. You know, I think people need to go to your website at one dog solutions and look you up and have a chat. And by the way, you must have given those office managers a sedative today because they’ve been very quiet, my friend.

We were hot and humid today, so short walks do wonders to keep them quiet.

So true. So true, my friend. Thank you very much and have. A wonderful week.

Yeah, you too.